Female PCT after Test Prop cycle

[F.I.S.T.]

Female PCT after Test Prop cycle
By Mh48500



As we all know there is not a ton of information out there about female steroid cycles, and a lot of what is written are men applying their steroid experience to a female. Well it does not apply.

Anyways a while back my wife was debating a test cycle and when I was not satisfied with the info available I turned to a few female members here for advice .That advice was invaluable and my wife decided to go forward.

I wanted to publish a cycle log but my wife did not want to. The cycle went great and the sides were relatively minimal...goals were acheived so I figure it was successful.
[size=14pt]
PCT - post cycle therapy -

Most people will say there is no need for PCT - post cycle therapy - with a woman, well they are wrong!!!! The shock of suddenly stopping the anabolic steroids has been a lot more than we expected. I dug around and found a post on another forum that pretty much says what I was looking for. Hopefully anyone planning a cycle, or currently in one can find some help from the post.

Ok... this subject has been up for debate for as long as i can remember... There are not many studies nor research as with anabolic steroids and PCT - post cycle therapy - for men...

So, i figured it was about time to make a post about women's PCT - post cycle therapy - options to help out women when coming off a cycle and to help men help women since we are VERY different!!!

Post cycle Therapy i am sure you have heard time and time again... For men, this usually includes an ancillary to re-stimulate natural test production etc. With women, PCT - post cycle therapy - is VERY VERY different.

I know it has been the general assumption that women do not need PCT - post cycle therapy - , however, it has come to my attention (and from years of experience) that we actually DO in fact need PCT - post cycle therapy - ...

Post cycle Therapy for women obviously does NOT include a test stimulant, but rather other factors...

Tapers: Everyone wants to know about tapering... Well, that really depends on the anabolic steroids you are using... The milder the anabolic steroids, the less the taper. For example, anavar does not call for a taper, however many women have seen less side effects post cycle with a little post cycle taper. This may be 1 week after you complete your cycle where you taper down. Considering the average dosage is 10mgs, a taper would be: (5, 5, 5, 2.5, 2.5, 2.5)

In my own personal experience with anavar, a taper for me really isn't necessary... so just stopping is fine. HOWEVER, i do apply Post cycle Therapy!

I feel PCT - post cycle therapy - should be considered due to these reasons:

Depression: MANY women report depression post cycle. I personally got it really really badly last nov, so now the last week of my cycle, i start cycling in 5HTP. You can also use St. Johns wart or valerian root etc...

Estrogen Rebound: Granted anavar is a mild androgenic, it is still an androgen. Some women experience a slight estrogen rebound. I personally have ALSO experienced this...

One of the ways i counteract it is to take "Twinlabs Male Fuel". This actually aids allowing my test levels to lower but not drop, thus preventing an estrogen rebound. When a hormone drops suddenly another one always tends to increase to counteract, even though it may not be beneficial to us...

Another way is to use a very very mild dosage of an estrogen suppressor (ie. nolvadex) to allow the estrogen to slowly level out as the test levels fall post cycle. (As our test levels begin to return to normal and decrease, estrogen will increase post cycle, due to the fact that an anabolic steroids does suppress estrogen levels a bit, so a suppressor will control the speed at which it increases- thus preventing a possible estrogen rebound!)

Appetite: Most anabolic steroids tend to increase your appetite. This has a bit to do with an accelerated metabolism (increased muscle and protein synthesis), nevertheless, anabolic steroids can increase appetite. With that said, I think a strict diet should follow your cycle.

My reasoning for this is that fact that since you have an increased appetite from using an anabolic steroids, now that that is over, you will continue to experience an increased appetite, but with no anabolic steroids anymore. Basically saying that now that you are OFF, you will not be using all the calories/fuel as efficiently as when you were ON. So if you splurge like crazy, you WILL notice a rebound in weight and or fat.

I HIGHLY recommend a clean diet for about 2 weeks POST cycle!!

My wife personally got hit hard with depression and major loss of apetite.

Good luck![/size]

 

[MattyIce]

there is no pct for women. HPTA reestablishment is the purpose for PCT in men. If you chick is depressed, get her on Prozac. If a chick takes Nolva, it has physiologically the same sides as running test most cases. Many female BB's cycle with Nolva. This "article" is useless.

 

[F.I.S.T.]

there is no pct for women. HPTA reestablishment is the purpose for PCT in men. If you chick is depressed, get her on Prozac. If a chick takes Nolva, it has physiologically the same sides as running test most cases. Many female BB's cycle with Nolva. This "article" is useless.

Absolutely incorrect.This post is useless.

Yea,just load her up on Prozac.Great advice..Not everyone is as weak willed as you are.,

 

[F.I.S.T.]

Here's another article from a competitive female bber on the subject............


Post Cycle Therapy For WOMEN
By SuperGirl

ok... this subject has been up for debate for as long as i can remember... There are not many studies nor research as with Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) and post cycle therapy (pct) for men...

So, i figured it was about time to make a post about women's post cycle therapy (pct) options to help out women when coming off a cycle and to help men help women since we are VERY different!!!

Post Cycle Therapy i am sure you have heard time and time again... For men, this usually includes an ancillary to re-stimulate natural test production etc. With women, post cycle therapy (pct) is VERY VERY different.
I know it has been the general assumption that women do not need post cycle therapy (pct), however, it has come to my attention (and from years of experience) that we actually DO in fact need post cycle therapy (pct)...

Post Cycle Therapy for women obviously does NOT include a test stimulant, but rather other factors...

Tapers: Everyone wants to know about tapering... Well, that really depends on the Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) you are using... The milder the aas, the less the taper. For example, anavar does not call for a taper, however many women have seen less side effects post cycle with a little post cycle taper. This may be 1 week after you complete your cycle where you taper down. Considering the average dosage is 10mgs, a taper would be: (5, 5, 5, 2.5, 2.5, 2.5)

In my own personal experience with anavar, a taper for me really isn't necessary... so just stopping is fine. HOWEVER, i do apply Post Cycle Therapy!

I feel post cycle therapy (pct) should be considered due to these reasons:

Depression: MANY women report depression post cycle. I personally got it really really badly last nov, so now the last week of my cycle, i start cycling in 5HTP. You can also use St. Johns wart or valerian root etc...
Estrogen Rebound: Granted anavar is a mild androgenic, it is still an androgen. Some women experience a slight estrogen rebound. I personally have ALSO experienced this...
One of the ways i counteract it is to take "Twinlabs Male Fuel". This actually aids allowing my test levels to lower but not drop, thus preventing an estrogen rebound. When a hormone drops suddenly another one always tends to increase to counteract, even though it may not be beneficial to us...
Another way is to use a very very mild dosage of an estrogen suppressor (ie. nolvadex) to allow the estrogen to slowly level out as the test levels fall post cycle. (As our test levels begin to return to normal and decrease, estrogen will increase post cycle, due to the fact that an Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) does suppress estrogen levels a bit, so a suppressor will control the speed at which it increases- thus preventing a possible estrogen rebound!)
Appetite: Most Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) tend to increase your appetite. This has a bit to do with an accelerated metabolism (increased muscle and protein synthesis), nevertheless, Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) can increase appetite. With that said, I think a strict diet should follow your cycle.
My reasoning for this is that fact that since you have an increased appetite from using an aas, now that that is over, you will continue to experience an increased appetite, but with no Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) anymore. Basically saying that now that you are OFF, you will not be using all the calories/fuel as efficiently as when you were ON. So if you splurge like crazy, you WILL notice a rebound in weight and or fat. Get it
I HIGHLY recommend a clean diet for about 2 weeks POST cycle!!



Those are the 3 main factors i can think of that may cause havoc with a woman's mental and physical well being post cycle... They are ALL factors i have personally dealt with, struggled with and learned to control!

As a female who is using aas, PLEASE know ALL the facts!!! Be over-prepared! There is nothing worse then a women who loves her results from weeks of suffering, training, dieting, etc... only to waste all her hard work and experience negative side effects post cycle... Estrogen rebound is a bitch. Weight/fat rebound is a bitch. Depression, we won't even go there lol...

So please ladies... LISTEN to your body. Get to really know what works for YOUR body! You may never need post cycle therapy, but you may... so good luck!!!

Stay Strong in the Iron Sisterhood!!

Luv super

 

[F.I.S.T.]

And yet another female bbr's input to this.Posted by Sadie.......


Nolvadex not a steroid but a WONDERFUL substance for women.. Estrogen causes water retention, fat retention around the hips, thighs, abs, and mood swings. 20mg of nolva ED will very rapidly reduce the fat storage in these areas and dry you out.. will also regulate mood nicely.. A must have IMO when coming off any cycle.. estrogen rebound is evil it should be called estrogen rage not "roid rage" lol I have literally run nolva year round since feb 08 and not gotten anything remotely resembling a side effect. i would not recommend this for everyone as it can effect fertility long term.

 

[tbonexl]

Again I'm not trying to stir up the pot here. The problem with reposting somebody else's material is you don't know much about it. It's like an opinion. You don't know from any first hand experience about it.

 

[F.I.S.T.]

Again I'm not trying to stir up the pot here. The problem with reposting somebody else's material is you don't know much about it. It's like an opinion. You don't know from any first hand experience about it.

No sir,thats my point.Being men,we can only go by the experiences of WOMEN who have used it.Reading something in a text book is quite different more times than not in actual real life practice so I go by those I know who have used it and recommend to others based on their experiences.If enough EXPERIENCED and PROVEN KNOWLEDGEABLE female bbers state something to be so,I am inclined to believe them and base my recommendations from their firsthand experiences.

 

[F.I.S.T.]

Here's from SASSY69.............

This. Keep in mind the basic effects of the different hormones you are looking to manipulate. Testosterone is geared towards promoting lean muscle mass & particularly the more androgenic / non-aromatizing compounds will promote hardness. Estrogen tends to promote 'system protective' effects in terms of water retention & fat gain in the midsection / hips area - basically to protect the fetus. Nolva is a selective estrogen receptor modulator (SERM) that acts to basically disconnect the estrogen process, to reduce the effect of estrogen - one of which is fat & water retention in the mid-section / thighs area. Nolva would, in a round about way, contribute to 'hardening' of legs if look at it as 'less softening'.

It is not good to suppress estrogen for a long period of time as the body interprets this as a reason to continue to suppress it and essentially decides it is now in early menopause. [size=14pt]Guidance is don't use longer than 8 weeks max. [/size]



And this.............


A LONG time. Don't ever look at it as a maintenance protocol. Sure you'll hear about some FBBs who have been on it for years, but they are also paying for it w/ all the features of early menopause. It may be acceptable for them, but I imagine it opens up the doors for the chance of all sorts of other tangential issues as you get older. Estrogen is there for a reason. Rely on diet & training to manage your bodyfat. Nolva should be looked at only in terms of a very near term and very distinct goal w/ a clear end date. So basically a really good example is the scenario of a competition prep or a photo shoot or some thing that has a clear end date and you assume you're going to go thru a recovery / rebound when its over, to allow your body to find homeostasis again.

In the specific situation where you might have back-to-back event, say separated by up to a month, you can push the nolva to 8-10 weeks. But just like the stress of doing multiple shows back to back, allow good recovery time, or else pick your primary target show and focus on that as your end date relative to the nolva schedule instead of trying to optimize every show.

Otherwise, I'd honestly keep it to like 6 months between. I'm not recommending using it every 6 months, but rather just plan your cycles ahead of time, don't pop them randomly and keep them for a specific purpose, and then schedule time for your body to recover and rely on diet & training for bodyfat management.

 

[F.I.S.T.]

And from Jenner 9another female bber).................


I don't know about making their legs harder but I am using it to keep water gain off..[size=14pt]if it's done correctly and for short periods of time there should be no issues. [/size]

 

[tbonexl]

Yea that's the thing. Most members here dont know who the op is in all your posts. We don't know if they do know their stuff or not. I've seen people post stuff that is completely ridiculous that others ate up. I've only glanced at a couple of these and seen some odd ball shit in there. You gotta remember that just cuz its posted somewhere else doesn't mean its g2g. You'll probably take all of this the wrong way but why post what other members of other boards posted here? Why not just invite them so we can pick their brains on their posts? Can't just go off of whatever whoever posted. They may be respected on other boards but mostly unknown here. Plus, look at it on the flip side. Would it be appreciated posting stuff on here at other boards?...

 

[F.I.S.T.]

Yea that's the thing. Most members here dont know who the op is in all your posts. We don't know if they do know their stuff or not. I've seen people post stuff that is completely ridiculous that others ate up. I've only glanced at a couple of these and seen some odd ball shit in there. You gotta remember that just cuz its posted somewhere else doesn't mean its g2g. You'll probably take all of this the wrong way but why post what other members of other boards posted here? Why not just invite them so we can pick their brains on their posts? Can't just go off of whatever whoever posted. They may be respected on other boards but mostly unknown here. Plus, look at it on the flip side. Would it be appreciated posting stuff on here at other boards?...

Im not taking it the wrong way at all and do respect everyone intelligent responses.As for most not knowing these ladies,I have to disagree.Sassy69 has been on countless boards for many many yrs and is a pro female bbr,staff on many boards and is a well respected member of the community.

Jenner as well.Not as well known as Sassy but well known none the less.As for the others,as they may not be known here,they are in the community and are also pro or competitive female bbers.

But again,these are opinions from females who have firsthand experience with these things and because of their reps in the community,I trust then enough to quote them.But anyone can do research for themselves and find the replies from actual FM bbers and see what they feel about it.

Im only passing along information for all to read up on and if so inclined do further research into it and make their own conclusions.

 

[MattyIce]

And yet another female bbr's input to this.Posted by Sadie.......


Nolvadex not a steroid but a WONDERFUL substance for women.. Estrogen causes water retention, fat retention around the hips, thighs, abs, and mood swings. 20mg of nolva ED will very rapidly reduce the fat storage in these areas and dry you out.. will also regulate mood nicely.. A must have IMO when coming off any cycle.. estrogen rebound is evil it should be called estrogen rage not "roid rage" lol I have literally run nolva year round since feb 08 and not gotten anything remotely resembling a side effect. i would not recommend this for everyone as it can effect fertility long term.

Tamox can and mostly will cause amenorrhea, moodiness, loss of appetite and bloating in women. I've seen it training several fitness models... my ex-wife included. Please, I know what I'm talking about, you do not.

BTW, taking Prozac is not "weak-minded" as you call me, I'd love to show you how weak minded I am, but I can only fantasize. Some people have chemical imbalances that certain pharms can help regulate.

 

[MattyIce]

And fwiw... I've known Jenner faaaar longer than you have read any of her posts... and she is not a female body builder. She is not pro as of last I talked to her.

 

[F.I.S.T.]

Tamox can and mostly will cause amenorrhea, moodiness, loss of appetite and bloating in women. I've seen it training several fitness models... my ex-wife included. Please, I know what I'm talking about, you do not.

BTW, taking Prozac is not "weak-minded" as you call me, I'd love to show you how weak minded I am, but I can only fantasize. Some people have chemical imbalances that certain pharms can help regulate.

So these womens personal use and experiences are not relevant in your opinion? The stating that they feel a woman does need a pct and have used Nolva with success means nothing because YOU say so huh?

As for some people needing certain pharms,again,yes the weak willed.The problem is today's generations need a shot or pill everytime they have what they feel is a hardship in their lives instead of growing a pair and learning to deal with things and get through it naturally.No different than a person that says "THEY NEED A DRINK" WEAKNESS,NOTHING ELSE!!

Whenever someone says they "NEED" something,its not a sign of strength,its a sign of weakness.PERIOD.A drug,a drink,a cigarette,WHATEVER their psychological crutch is at that time.

 

[F.I.S.T.]

And fwiw... I've known Jenner faaaar longer than you have read any of her posts... and she is not a female body builder. She is not pro as of last I talked to her.

That may very well be so and if it is than you know that she uses Nolva and said the exact quote I posted from her.So her experience with it and the need for a pct and her opinion based on that experience with them means nothing as well because YOU say so?

By the way,never said she was a pro,just that she was well known in the community,only less than Sassy.

 

[MattyIce]

So these womens personal use and experiences are not relevant in your opinion? The stating that they feel a woman does need a pct and have used Nolva with success means nothing because YOU say so huh?

As for some people needing certain pharms,again,yes the weak willed.The problem is today's generations need a shot or pill everytime they have what they feel is a hardship in their lives instead of growing a pair and learning to deal with things and get through it naturally.No different than a person that says "THEY NEED A DRINK" WEAKNESS,NOTHING ELSE!!

Whenever someone says they "NEED" something,its not a sign of strength,its a sign of weakness.PERIOD.A drug,a drink,a cigarette,WHATEVER their psychological crutch is at that time.

You arrogant small-minded prick... let me tell you something you moron... when I woke next to my wifes dead body and had to try an resuscitate her corpse for 1 hour while I waited for the paramedics... to you I am weak minded for needing help from psychiatrist prescribed meds, right. Asking for help was a sign of weakness to you, right?

Dude... you thrive on the anonymity of the internet. In the real world, I can't imagine your mouth not writing a check your old ass can't cash.

 

[F.I.S.T.]

You arrogant small-minded prick... let me tell you something you moron... when I woke next to my wifes dead body and had to try an resuscitate her corpse for 1 hour while I waited for the paramedics... to you I am weak minded for needing help from psychiatrist prescribed meds, right. Asking for help was a sign of weakness to you, right?

Dude... you thrive on the anonymity of the internet. In the real world, I can't imagine your mouth not writing a check your old ass can't cash.

Im sorry to tell you again,but yes,its a sign of weakness.

Let me tell you kid,I defended this country and had brothers die in my arms so dont tell me about someone dying kid.Been there more times than you know and while you were still playing with your pee pee jr.

So whether you want to accept it or not,"needing" a drug of any kind is a sign of weakness!! Whether you think it was a justified weakness or not,still what it is.

As for my mouth writing checks mt ass cant cash boy,while you're playing internet tough guy and making excuses on why you had to be doped up,I was living in the real world fighting for our nation and living the life boy! I don't have to try and impress some internet punk because you're not worthy of it.

Now go take another prozak and bitch in another of my threads.

 

[MattyIce]

You are nothing. You shut our fucking mouth right now. You disgrace my wifes death one more time and I will find you and take a fucking baseball bat to your head you piece of shit. Respond to this with anything but an open apology and consider it done. If I am banned... so be it.

 

[morrey]

You two need to stay the fuck away from each other