Coming off completely with NO PCT????

[Z82]

Been blasting and cruising for a little over a year now. Blood work was good for the first half then went bad and then got it under control again and now just got results back and its all over the place again. One major concern is my hdl has never gotten better but only worse and also my platelets count is through the roof.

I have decided to come off everything except fish oil and aspirin. I don't want the nasty pct drugs at all. I've made some very solid muscle gains in this time and all of it has been slow and steady with no drastic gains.

What do you guys think about not pcting? How much lean mass should I expect to lose. What other concerns should I have? I know all the usual but want to get the bros outlook on everything. If my levels take a while to bounce back I may hit up the doc for a trt script....but I'm more worried about my body balancing out.

Let me know what the bros think.

 

[krustus]

i would at least do a testosterone taper... taper down to about 100mgs a week... then run 100mgs a a week to let you body adjust to a somewhat more normal level of test for about 4-6 weeks then taper off the test. 100mg , then next week 80, next 60...etc till you are completely off.

i did this before and also used a low dose serm the last few weeks... i was over 40 at the time so my levels didn't come all the way back, but the transition from on cycle to off was very smooth and seamless..... at least might help with the shock of stopping cold?

 

[Z82]

Yeah I was thinking that too but my concern is my hdl did not bounce back even while cruising. I blamed it on my diet which I cleaned up tremendously and still were not getting better. I'm afraid the exogenous test may be holding it back. But ultimately the bad diet and tren did the initial damage.

I'm wanting to get hdl back to normal ASAP.

 

[flyingfox]

Pct or no pct, you will eventually end up at the same place....this is a concept some folks just don't get. Many think the pct drugs bring you back to where you were but this is not their purpose....the whole point is to provide a smooth transition, a buffer if you will so that it's not such a shock to your system physically and mentally.


i would do the PCT myself.
Good luck and get those numbers in check!

 

[lith56bigguy]

Z,

As you know we've both went through this.... Let me ask you this.... Does anyone in your family have a high chol disorder??? My whole family does I've recently found out. I have an uncle thats ran in the 4's all his life and has done nothing about it. Next question, how long did you cruise for???? All in all your health is the most important, I was just wondering how much of a break you actually gave yourself before blasting again cause I remember when your thread came out... Do the pct man.. The idea is to get everything stabilized and I believe time is in order to do that.... We all wanna be a monster, believe me its killing me now also to not bang a cycle... IF you're not going to pct at least do the test taper weening yourself down....

 

[Jinko]

I did this once. Man it was huge mistake. I do what Krustus suggested.

 

[Boltbreaker]

TAPER fuck those PCT drugs. I would add in HCG Blast if me though

 

[krustus]

i'm no doc,.. but 100mgs a week for 4-6 weeks then a 4 week taper... the doses should be low enough not to cause further issues... if it does with the hdl... then i would think there is another issue at work here (maybe hereditary as lith suggested) or your diet is really bad?

sesamin is suppose to good for this hdl issue i think.. and that research chem ...GW501516... has reports of great effects on cholesterol

 

[Z82]

Z,

As you know we've both went through this.... Let me ask you this.... Does anyone in your family have a high chol disorder??? My whole family does I've recently found out. I have an uncle thats ran in the 4's all his life and has done nothing about it. Next question, how long did you cruise for???? All in all your health is the most important, I was just wondering how much of a break you actually gave yourself before blasting again cause I remember when your thread came out... Do the pct man.. The idea is to get everything stabilized and I believe time is in order to do that.... We all wanna be a monster, believe me its killing me now also to not bang a cycle... IF you're not going to pct at least do the test taper weening yourself down....

You know I don't have a lot of family around to know much. But from what I do know there isn't many problems. I have no problem getting my bad cholesterol down at all its only my good cholesterol that is the problem. My total cholesterol is 149 , anything under 200 is normal. My ldl was only slightly high. Hdl came in at 10. Went from 22 to 18 to 10 anything under 39 is low.

I cruise for around two months or until blood work gets close to normal. When I started blasting again my hdl was low but I thought cleaning up my diet would fix that.....I thought wrong. All other levels were normal.

I'm going to come off and take at least six months off and let all the soft tissue heal. I'm going to focus on getting to 225lbs and under 15% BF

 

[Hanzo]

I had to come off in a hurry also, 5 months ago. I knew it was coming tho and I was already tapering down to trt (125mg's/week). I did a half assed PCT and I was sorry for that. I felt really, really crappy. Super lethargic. I say PCT bro.

1 other fact, I was on for almost 2 years.

 

[Z82]

Yeah my diet is 90% clean. I eat chicken, fish and turkey only as protein source with the occasional low cal shake. 3 cups of broccoli a day. Oat meal every morning with stevia and cinnamon. Egg whites, brown rice. Everything cooked in olive oil. Only couple egg yolks a week as a treat and no red meat at all. The other 10% is usually once a week treat with the family such as pizza or Mexican food. Maybe a few cookies with milk. On top of all this I do 1.5 to 2 hours a week of cardio and at least 5 to 6 hours a week of high intensity weights training. I think coming off and getting a base line for blood work will be good and if hdl doesn't come up then asking doc about a cholesterol med possibly.

 

[Hanzo]

Your diet sounds good. Makes me feel like cleaning up mine! lol

Get your health back bro. I'm feeling good now 5 months post PCT, it took a little bit though.

Keep on truckin', you'll get there.

 

[krustus]

I cruise for around two months or until blood work gets close to normal.

What was your cruise dose?... and how long did you blast?... seems like most of the year would be spent on a trt dose only if health is your first concern... or at least 6 months or more of the year.

 

[TSizemore]

Yeah my diet is 90% clean. I eat chicken, fish and turkey only as protein source with the occasional low cal shake. 3 cups of broccoli a day. Oat meal every morning with stevia and cinnamon. Egg whites, brown rice. Everything cooked in olive oil. Only couple egg yolks a week as a treat and no red meat at all. The other 10% is usually once a week treat with the family such as pizza or Mexican food. Maybe a few cookies with milk. On top of all this I do 1.5 to 2 hours a week of cardio and at least 5 to 6 hours a week of high intensity weights training. I think coming off and getting a base line for blood work will be good and if hdl doesn't come up then asking doc about a cholesterol med possibly.

How in the world do you have messed up cholesterol?? What the hell did your cycle look like??

 

[Z82]

What was your cruise dose?... and how long did you blast?... seems like most of the year would be spent on a trt dose only if health is your first concern... or at least 6 months or more of the year.

Cruised at 200mgs cyp a week for two months. Would blast for about 14 weeks. Did three blasts in the last year. Two of them were 14,weeks and one for 6 weeks. So 34 weeks on blast and only 18 weeks on cruise. Two of those using tren for 10 weeks each. Tren being as harsh as it is, probably should not have used them so close together. Maybe my body doesn't need tren at all.

 

[Hanzo]

Since you've been on that long I'd really advise you go through a good PCT. The drop in Test levels is devastating (was to me) and I think a good PCT will help ease the transition, as someone stated above.

 

[Z82]

How in the world do you have messed up cholesterol?? What the hell did your cycle look like??

1st blast was

1-10 tren a 600 week
1-14 test 600 a week
1-4 50mg ed methyl dht
Asin 25mgs EOD
Caber e3d

2nd blast

1-6 test 750 week
1-6mast 600 week
1-6 var 100mgs ed
1-4 inject superdrol 40mgs ed

Ended that blast because of underdosed gear.

3rd blast

1-10 tren a 600mgs
1-14 test 750 week
1-14 mast e 600 week
1-10 var 80-100 mgs ed
Asin 25mgs e3d
Caber e3d

2 months cruising in between and I did much on a few dbol inbetween

Edit....also had several months if peptide use in there and 1 month of HGH which I just came off from thus week.

 

[Z82]

My diet has only been this clean for the last 4 months. Before that I was keto dieting off and on with tons of meat and steak and lots of eggs

 

[Z82]

Since you've been on that long I'd really advise you go through a good PCT. The drop in Test levels is devastating (was to me) and I think a good PCT will help ease the transition, as someone stated above.

I really appreciate all your input but I'm seriously paranoid about pct drugs. If anything I might hcg blast with a test taper.

 

[Hanzo]

Yeah, you have to find legit products, but, a PCT of Aromasin for 2 weeks along with Torem for 3 more is very mild compared to Nolva and Clomid.

You could also use OTC's like Damage Control, Cycle Assist and PCT Assist. At least then you're reconditioning your liver and other internals. You can also use DAA (which has raised Test levels 42% in 12 days in clinical trials) and definitely start using DIM, that's a must, IMO.