Where do you identify?

[T-bar]

Interesting turn we've taken in this thread. It's not where I was headed at all, but interesting none the less. My point was never about respecting or not respecting someone else. I have no issue with someone who is gay, or someone who wants to be married even if they are marrying someone of the same sex. My point was that special treatment is going too far. I personally don't believe that someone with a penis belongs in a girls locker room or bathroom. My taking steroids is ME doing something to ME. Now if I start demanding that I should be able to compete in sports against people who aren't using steroids then that's wrong, plain and simple. Yet today we see boys, who claim they don't feel like boys, competing against girls and that's ok because we need to accept them for who they are? No.

My beef is with America's need to take everything past the point of common sense and demand extra special treatment. I can't think of anything good that's come from that.

 

[LittleTom]

Interesting turn we've taken in this thread. It's not where I was headed at all, but interesting none the less. My point was never about respecting or not respecting someone else. I have no issue with someone who is gay, or someone who wants to be married even if they are marrying someone of the same sex. My point was that special treatment is going too far. I personally don't believe that someone with a penis belongs in a girls locker room or bathroom. My taking steroids is ME doing something to ME. Now if I start demanding that I should be able to compete in sports against people who aren't using steroids then that's wrong, plain and simple. Yet today we see boys, who claim they don't feel like boys, competing against girls and that's ok because we need to accept them for who they are? No.

My beef is with America's need to take everything past the point of common sense and demand extra special treatment. I can't think of anything good that's come from that.

T-bar
I think soon all bathrooms will be sexless bathrooms with stalls..

 

[T-bar]

I think they will be single use bathrooms, although I've been in some INCREDIBLE restrooms where they each had a 100% private stall area and a shared sink area and it could easily have been for any sex.

 

[T-bar]

Here's a video of a woman in Florida that may just love her restroom a bit too much, but it's what I'm talking about.
https://youtu.be/MKz7yEO0fH0

 

[R2D2]

i am attempting to change my gender from man to cyborg. don't hate on me, friends.

 

[zombieslayer]

I get what your saying man but there is little difference IMO. We are both trying to do the same thing, change what we were naturally supposed to be. Look at Jay Cutler, Arnold, ect... do they look anything like a normal human being... one could argue that a woman changing into a man may look more normal than the results those guys achieve. We can go round and round all day but lets look at a couple things....

1. Both inject hormones
2. Both are trying to change the way the look (and are reprieved by others)
3. Both seem to be unsatisfied the way they look naturally

I get we are not changing sexes but really.... how on earth can you say what they are doing is wrong....

LittleTom
Yes, you are naming ways that they are similiar, but that does not make the two qualitatively the same.

A male injecting male hormones for the benefit of adding muscle, size, strength, definition, etc.
is not the same as a female injecting male hormones or a male injecting female hormones for the sake of trying to "identify" as the opposite sex.

Does a person by adding tattooing and other body modifications, to make them look like a leopard, actually make them a leopard? No.

Nor does adding hormones change someone's gender.

Historically, the treatment for gender dysphoria has been to treat it based on biology.
But, now all of a sudden, we are to treat it based on the 'feeling'.
What they 'feel' like at the time. They 'feel' like a man trapped in a woman's body, etc.

Well, let's face it, feelings are wrong all of the time.
Sometimes, I don't 'feel' like loving my wife.
But, if I lived my life based on chasing a feeling, my life would be spiraling out of control.
I used to do that, actually, when I was hook on alcohol and drugs and sex.

But, we have to live our lives based on things other than 'feelings'.

Example:
Studies show that people who 'felt' like getting a divorce(of course, they 'felt' like it would fix their problems), the ones who stuck it out, 5 years later were glad they did, in almost all cases.
But the ones who did get a divorce, 5 years later, had just traded one set of problems for another set, in almost all cases.

My point is treating any condition based on 'feelings' is not good methodology, with gender dysphoria or pretty much anything else in life.

Feelings can be a symptom of a problem, but trying to treat the symptom and not the cause of the problem is not the answer.
And it does the person with the problem a great, and often dangerous, disservice.

 

[tkasch30]

LT is just trying to make excuses now so when he becomes a women soon he can say it's the same thing you guys are doing!!! injecting hormones. Lol

 

[blasson]

Haha. Yea there is no way in hell they can be compared. I think you're right tk.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[LittleTom]

Lol tk. You can call me little Tina. Getting a tattoo, thats your rebuttle.. Yes the end result of what we are doing is night and day different. We start out small and get bid. They start out as men and become women or the other way around. The bottom line is we are both making ourselves something we could never be without the use of chemicals, in this case ironically the same hormones.


Lets go back to Hanzos article on transgender being a mental disease. I feel the same could be said about us. What drives us to take ourselves to the limits we do... What makes us unsatisfied with our natural bodies. Why do we feel the need to ALTER ourselves........

Thats what we are doing gentlemen. We are altering what we were given at birth. I FUCKING LOVE IT. So why should we say they cant love the alteration of their bodys....?

 

[T-bar]

We are altering what we were given at birth. I FUCKING LOVE IT. So why should we say they cant love the alteration of their bodys....?

LittleTom
But show me where any of us are asking for special treatment. Show me where bodybuilders are asking to have laws changed because they are choosing to inject hormones that assist them in building muscle. Show me where we are asking those who don't understand or respect our lifestyle to support it through their tax dollars or saying we should be allowed to go into the women's locker room because our testosterone levels are higher and everyone should just accept our feelings and desires for more sex.

 

[Hanzo]

Guys you also have to respect people even if they're mentally ill like you claim. If you make fun of someone with down's syndrome. Everyone would think you are a horrible person. So if they're mentally ill like some of you guys claimed than you would be a horrible person using your own logic.

I don't necessarily agree with it either but calling them names is bigotry. They're humans too and deserve respect for that reason. Just like you deserve respect for being a human. Even if you don't agree with their actions. They still deserve respect. If someone doesn't like something about you. Is it okay for them to disrespect you? nope.

Stop the spread of hate guys.

dyel
Who is "claiming" anything? The links I provided are from a DR. with 40 years in the field. How much proof do dome people need to have? Derp.

As far as the rest of your post .... meh. I never advocated hatred or violence against anyone. That being said, when people make a habit of trying to get in one's face, at the instigation of surrogates who are only using these people to make political points, you can expect pushback.

 

[Hanzo]

Lol tk. You can call me little Tina. Getting a tattoo, thats your rebuttle.. Yes the end result of what we are doing is night and day different. We start out small and get bid. They start out as men and become women or the other way around. The bottom line is we are both making ourselves something we could never be without the use of chemicals, in this case ironically the same hormones.


Lets go back to Hanzos article on transgender being a mental disease. I feel the same could be said about us. What drives us to take ourselves to the limits we do... What makes us unsatisfied with our natural bodies. Why do we feel the need to ALTER ourselves........

Thats what we are doing gentlemen. We are altering what we were given at birth. I FUCKING LOVE IT. So why should we say they cant love the alteration of their bodys....?

LittleTom
You're not trying to change your actual sex bro. Or in the case of those who "identify" as TG, you're not trying to make anyone else embrace an obvious lie. The thing is, there are many pols who are actively engaging (and succeeding) in trying to force us into something that's patently false through legislative fiat. That's communism.

This is a culture war and they are being used as a battering ram to force us to conform to false beliefs. Does anyone else see the nefarious implications here? Once again, we are being forced to believe (at least to appear that we do) through legislation (TG bathroom laws, etc.) something that is anathema to our society at large.

 

[Hanzo]

Respect is given for simply being a human. You have to respect a brain-dead patient. Do they have any ability to "earn respect"? nope. So respect is not earned it's given for simply being a human.

Example: If you go to have lunch somewhere. Does the waiter have to give you respect because you earned it? No.. they simply give you respect because you are a customer.

also you are redefining what mentally ill means then... If this is truly a matter of being mentally ill. They did not decide to become mentally ill like you claim. You don't decide overnight well today Im going to have bipolar or today I will like the same sex. Mentally ill is not a decision. These individual spends months and months thinking about it. Just like being bipolar develops over time.

I wouldn't be so quick to judge. If I dislike something you do. Am I allowed to disrespect you? no. So why does that suddenly change for someone who's gay?

I don't necessarily think transgenders is the way to go. however for the 1% that are born with the opposite sex genitals. I do think this is a real solution for those kids. I would imagine it being traumatic. Imagine being a 13 year old girl with a penis. That poor little girl is going to suffer from being made fun of day and night.

When you argue against transgenders realize you are also arguing against these special cases.

dyel
OMG, this is PC (politically Correct) fatuous drivel, at best.

Here we go, this is gonna be easy.

"Respect is given for simply being a human. You have to respect a brain-dead patient. Do they have any ability to "earn respect? nope.So respect is not earned it's given for simply being a human." Wow, this is a canard, a straw man argument and a non sequitur. In other words, you state that we have to give people respect (no we don't), you try to put a supposition in someone elses place, and you attempt to change the argument from TG's to a brain dead person. That's also equivocation. You don't have the ability to delineate our Rights to us by telling us we can't disrespect someone. Sorry pal, I can disrespect anyone, anytime, anyplace I want. Are you also advocating, by extension, for hate crimes? That's Orwellian and a violation of our 1st Amendment Rights. Not to mention, as TK ascertained, rapists, murderers, etc. don't deserve our respect. Sorry, next ....

"Example: If you go to have lunch somewhere. Does the waiter have to give you respect because you earned it? No.. they simply give you respect because you are a customer." Terrible example, what you're talking about here is entering into a financial transaction. Guess what? The server is being nice because they want a big tip. Nothing wrong with that. I have, as I'm sure we all have, encountered servers who exhibit marginal service at best. I still tip them because I figure maybe they're just having a bad day. However, if they would have indulged me with utmost service, guess what? I would have tipped more generously. Very bad analogy, bruh. Next .....

"also you are redefining what mentally ill means then... If this is truly a matter of being mentally ill." Uh, no, actually you are trying, in vain, to redefine what is a mental illness and what isn't. Are you anti-science? Did you not even read the links I provided? This man, a DR., is the foremost researcher in this field, yet you dismiss his research, which engaged hundreds, or thousands, of patients in a clinical study that spanned decades. Egotistical much? It's rather humorous, all you have to offer is your weak, ill-informed hyperbole and pontificant rhetoric. You're WAY out of your league here. Next ....

" Am I allowed to disrespect you? no." Sigh. Once again, we do have certain inalienable Rights, which, regardless of your authoritarian tendencies, aren't delineated by the likes of you. Am I advocating hatred towards TG's? Of course not, but you can't trample one's Rights in order to assert another's. Doesn't work that way bro. Next ....

"I don't necessarily think transgenders is the way to go. however for the 1% ...." Still yet, your opinion and rank hyperbole. Where do you get these "stats"? "The most frequently cited estimate is that 700,000 people in the United States, or about 0.2 to 0.3 percent of the population, are transgender". From the Census Bureau. Next ....

" ... opposite sex genitals.I would imagine it being traumatic. Imagine being a 13 year old girl with a penis." Wow. Just wow. FYI - that's not a "girl with a penis", that's a boy who is mentally unbalanced. Everyone is born with the genitals of the biological sex THAT THEY ARE. It's in your DNA. If you really cared you would be advocating for these poor people to get the clinical mental help they need. Next ....

"When you argue against transgenders realize you are also arguing against these special cases." Hmm ... just WTF does that even mean? Arguing against what "special cases", and in what way? Are you asserting that we're arguing against TG because we're haters or want to see someone not get the help they need? Are you saying we're "arguing against these special cases" (once again, whatever that could be construed to mean) because we want to see them get the proper mental health care, not mutilation of their bodies (including the attendant psychological distress, as TG's have an astronomical suicide rate). If so, this would be the 1st correct assessment you made in your deluded, rambling post.

Ok, rant over. Carry on.

 

[bigdude]

What Hanzo said...

 

[LittleTom]

You're not trying to change your actual sex bro. Or in the case of those who "identify" as TG, you're not trying to make anyone else embrace an obvious lie. The thing is, there are many pols who are actively engaging (and succeeding) in trying to force us into something that's patently false through legislative fiat. That's communism.

This is a culture war and they are being used as a battering ram to force us to conform to false beliefs. Does anyone else see the nefarious implications here? Once again, we are being forced to believe (at least to appear that we do) through legislation (TG bathroom laws, etc.) something that is anathema to our society at large.

Hanzo
On this point i agree. In many past posts (not in this thread) i have stated this is the one area where progressive thinking messes up. When someone tries to force you to accept their belief system. I may not harbor any ill will twords transgender but I like a few of you will be damed if i am told i HAVE to like it. This may sound hypocritical however, i do not want a transgender woman who used to be a man in the same bathroom as my wife or daughter. They do whatever they want but there are still norms to society. Just as accept the fact steroids are illegal. There is a fine line between acceptance and indoctrinating. My stance is let them be but dont tell me i have to go along with their rules. No one should just get to come along and change everything because they think its just. This is going to be a huge topic for some time

 

[T-bar]

So now the question is.... what would you do if your girlfriend or wife that you have loved for many years were to suddenly disclose that they used to be a man but now, after surgery, they are 100% a woman.

Or what if the incredibly hot Mrs. Krustus had a special secret she needs to share with all you guys who have been drooling over her back side? ???

 

[T-bar]

Oh oh.... Krustus just came on line.... I gotta go

 

[LittleTom]

So now the question is.... what would you do if your girlfriend or wife that you have loved for many years were to suddenly disclose that they used to be a man but now, after surgery, they are 100% a woman.

Or what if the incredibly hot Mrs. Krustus had a special secret she needs to share with all you guys who have been drooling over her back side? ???

T-bar
I guess it depends on if it counts as a threesome... that would give me some instant street cred...

 

[T-bar]

I guess it depends on if it counts as a threesome... that would give me some instant street cred...

LittleTom
Spoken like a true street thug! Respect!

 

[zombieslayer]

Getting a tattoo, thats your rebuttle..

LittleTomI'm not sure if that was your rebuttal to my rebuttal, or not.

But if it was, then you did not read the entirety of my argument, because you certainly missed my point.

My answer was very clearly laid out. Anyone who's interested can go back and read it.
8) 8) 8)